What team composition do you think is optimal?

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What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#1 » 10 May 2016, 16:27

Before trying to counter the opponent team, and not complicating the choice with game type.
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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#2 » 10 May 2016, 16:29

With the way the game is right now, I think 1 tank and 1 healer is required for serious play, but outside of that I don't think it matters if people are on offensive or defensive heroes. For instance, without being in super competitive play, I can do just as good with Junkrat on attack as I can on defense, same as Pharah.

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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#3 » 10 May 2016, 16:31

2 tanks (Rheinheart), 1 healer and at least 1 turret spec is all you need regardless of the map or game style. You will always win!

Of course i have also seen 6 dwarfs win and 6 support classes win. Class stacking is retarded OP if you stick together adn use certain terrain advantages.

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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#4 » 10 May 2016, 16:35

The way competitive works is 2 supports, 1/2 tanks and 2/3 assault characters.

Double lucio is incredibly strong. Winston is also an excellent cleave champ, bastion seems strong unless you play against decent people who can swap to genji and instantly counter you.

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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#5 » 10 May 2016, 16:42

So far I've seen little to no response to a well coordinated Reinheart shielding a Bastion, along with a mercy damage buff, who also heals others. I've theorized taken a 3rd step with torbjorn securing any possible flank position. which locks up 4 heroes. And while bastion can solo the entire team with the mercy damage buff at ease. Giving him support with other damaging characters such as solider and a sniper such as hazno or windowmaker cause "f**" it" i really wish to try this out at a top tier. With just bastion and Reinheart alone i won 17 straight games "deffensive and offensive" able to carry a entire team with 2 people following that up further would be quite the tacit i would think.


Max damage done in 1 game
63,819
Max elimation done in 1 game
45 *fixed
Max solo kills in 1 game "so i feel like it doesn't count cause i'm behind a Reinheart shield"
14

From anyone i've added on B.Net i haven't seen anyone beat these stats and i never got a mercy to damage boost me for a entire game. My cousin and i were well coordinated over skype with Reinheart Shield and it is much needed. If anyone has done better with a certain comp let me know i wish to playing this game at a respectable level.

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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#6 » 10 May 2016, 17:40

Bastion is incredibly faceroll in pub matches, but as soon as a team is competent enough and learn how to flank the reinhardt shield or actually leave the bastion alone it's pointless. One genji deflect and bastion is gone in 1 second. Defense on the other hand he is a bit more of a problem to deal with, but most maps have flank routes that are decent enough to remove the threat.

Maybe I'm missing something but I've always had zero problems dealing with bastion. Maybe it's because I play his direct counter on most matches.

I also forgot to mention in my earlier post that double lucio is incredibly strong only on certain pushes. On longer run backs a mercy is much more useful as her rez is almost necessary to have.

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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#7 » 10 May 2016, 18:18

That's where the well coordination comes in. On a offensive map it's a whole different ball game when it comes to that current comp's strategy, pushing it's often a spur of the moment type thing. on defense though there are so many corners plateaus to take advantage of that i can safely say there is no such thing as flanking bastion reinheart. But you can just run straight at him with deflect/reflect, simply though just stop shooting the genji reflect and if you do it for a second to long the reinheart shield has you covered. multiple genjis attacking at once different story though. but requires fast reflex too if you using mercy boost, genji will die in less than a second so fast reaction or preemptive use of reflect is the only way. But the distance you must cover along with rein-heart being right there with you so that he can help kill him if gets in to close. BUT i have seen effective use of multiple people pushing with Dva's absorbs all bullets while people poor damage onto me it has effectively pushed me out of places Reinheart shield has not though for you can simpy chew through the 2k shield but Dva's absorb is a timer and can not be dps'd through. In short no one person counters the combo, which is what makes it so effective and it is not like two people naturally counter the combo they must be coordinated.

I think that's what makes it so strong at least in what i have done cause people haven't coordinated to counter it. when you start throwing in the dwarfs turret you then need more people to counter it. Because what happens when you try to run straight at bastion through deflects/reflects the turret around the corner is shooting you in the back so whatever way you face you get shot. So now you need 3 people to counter the 3 man setup. And the more and more people you add to the comp the more people it takes to counter you. 1 person can't beat Reinheart bastion because it's setup in such a way that it's a 2 champ combo with no weak-points vrs any single 1. you adjust that to make it where takes 3-4 people it then takes 3-4 to counter it. and not just simply pick those 3 champions to counter it you must line up behind each other face the proper directions and then hit your shots all in the next 3 seconds in sync or die. Thinking even more about it that's how the game is going to played. Certain compositions that require more multiple people operating like a well oiled machine to counter it. The only one i can think of is the Reinheart Bastion combo, and as i said you can take it steps further with other people working with you to make where it takes more than 2 or 3 people to counter it. Focusing more on what synergies extremely well is going to be the base line of thinking. and until it's seen you won't know what to pick as a team to counter it. Which then develops other strategies such as no one lock in a champ until we scouted what they have "as a offensive team" so someone would pick tracer run around really quick at the start make the calls of what people have where they are everyone lock in real quick then push. I feel like this is going to be truly a team game at the highest level of play where 1 player can not stand tall because the other team has made it impossible for a person to win alone. In conclusion you can't pick 1 champion to beat a comp, if that's your comp then it's terrible you need to start making comps where it takes more than 1 champion to beat so on and so forth.

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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#8 » 10 May 2016, 19:04

Wow, great responses, and a lot to think about. You guys are 100% right in how strong the Bastion/Reinhardt combo is... we tried it on one or two maps with our group, and it wrecked the opponent team. I'm not sure why we didnt use it more often.

But, you guys know how Blizzard is... the second they see people implementing the Reinhardt/Bastion combo too much, they will nerf it to hell. I could definately see a slight nerf to bastion's turretting damage being expected in upcoming months. If they don't nerf the damage... they may nerf the firing speed, reload speed, etc... there are so many ways they could rebalance (destroy) these classes with just a tiny tweak. Maybe they make Reinhardt's shield only useable while he moves... or increase the cooldown by 3 seconds... or lower the blocking damage. Who knows... but I definately expect some tweaks to be coming out now that they have a large pull of data from the beta to work with.

As for the perfect group composition, I would say:

1 Tank - Preferrably Reinhardt or Winston

1 Support - Mercy's rez is a necessity, but Lucio's output when the group is close together is hard to beat.

2 Defense - Junkrat is so flexible in his ability to defend or attack. And the other would be Torjborn or Bastion.

2 DPS - I saw some people say it didnt matter much about the dps comp, but I really think it does. I think its important that one DPS must have good vertical mobility... like Phara or Widomaker. If both of your dps are stuck on the ground like McCree and Soldier 76, you are really lacking in the ability to hunt down snipers and balcony Bastions. You don't want to have to run through the zig-zagging flights of stairs and hallways to get to the top of a building, when Phara can just press LShift. Genji and Hanzo are kind of middle ground, in that they can get up high in most situations, provided there is a wall that leads strait up. Long story short, I would say a good combo is Phara/Genji... or Widomaker/Soldier 76. This could also be offset a bit if you have a defense character like Junkrat who can be vertical when used right.
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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#9 » 10 May 2016, 19:10

Mccree is by far the strongest dps champion in the game. His instant kill capabilities are absolutely insane with flash bangg and fan the hammer. His ultimate also zones teams, as they need to hide behind walls or one shot.

Soldier 76 is a bit underrated, but with great aim he has the highest damage output out of the dps classes. His use isn't for finishing kills moreso putting people low enough that other champs can jump in and kill. Another thing I've seen is that his strongest map is Gibraltar (or whatever the map is called) as he can stand on top of the jet or the catwalk and rain down fire.

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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#10 » 10 May 2016, 19:15

SGTMinor wrote:So far I've seen little to no response to a well coordinated Reinheart shielding a Bastion, along with a mercy damage buff, who also heals others. I've theorized taken a 3rd step with torbjorn securing any possible flank position. which locks up 4 heroes. And while bastion can solo the entire team with the mercy damage buff at ease. Giving him support with other damaging characters such as solider and a sniper such as hazno or windowmaker cause "f**" it" i really wish to try this out at a top tier. With just bastion and Reinheart alone i won 17 straight games "deffensive and offensive" able to carry a entire team with 2 people following that up further would be quite the tacit i would think.


Max damage done in 1 game
63,819
Max elimation done in 1 game
45 *fixed
Max solo kills in 1 game "so i feel like it doesn't count cause i'm behind a Reinheart shield"
14

From anyone i've added on B.Net i haven't seen anyone beat these stats and i never got a mercy to damage boost me for a entire game. My cousin and i were well coordinated over skype with Reinheart Shield and it is much needed. If anyone has done better with a certain comp let me know i wish to playing this game at a respectable level.


I had a 37 elimination match this morning as widowmaker, with close to 20k dmg done (no mercy). She's pretty broken, and her ulti is amazing. I'd argue that Mei is a pretty strong character to have on every team as well as you can do some much zoning with her ice wall when used properly

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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#11 » 10 May 2016, 19:17

Magnifeye wrote:Mccree is by far the strongest dps champion in the game. His instant kill capabilities are absolutely insane with flash bangg and fan the hammer. His ultimate also zones teams, as they need to hide behind walls or one shot.

Soldier 76 is a bit underrated, but with great aim he has the highest damage output out of the dps classes. His use isn't for finishing kills moreso putting people low enough that other champs can jump in and kill. Another thing I've seen is that his strongest map is Gibraltar (or whatever the map is called) as he can stand on top of the jet or the catwalk and rain down fire.

Soldier 76 is amazing haha He gets overlooked imo because he is a bit bland and not flashy, but he is still very strong.

SGTMinor

Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#12 » 10 May 2016, 19:36

I don't know how i feel about Mei she seems really strong flexible still has weakpoints. But in a nutshell i think she is just a bitch to have on the other team. it's like one of the most cheesiest champions i hate her. even if i'm sniping at range with Hanzo I hate her. i don't know where to put her into a comp though other than the annoying one

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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#13 » 10 May 2016, 20:33

SGTMinor wrote:I don't know how i feel about Mei she seems really strong flexible still has weakpoints. But in a nutshell i think she is just a bitch to have on the other team. it's like one of the most cheesiest champions i hate her. even if i'm sniping at range with Hanzo I hate her. i don't know where to put her into a comp though other than the annoying one


I second this... couldnt stand playing against Mei. But at the same time, I never felt she was strong enough that we needed one on our team. It's like her soul purpose is to be a pain in the ass. Thats a similar role as Tracer, but I feel Tracer has more impact on the game.
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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#14 » 10 May 2016, 20:40

I would not tie yourself into finding a perfect comp of specific heroes because anything can be countered. Every hero has their strengths and especially weaknesses. I know nobody likes picking symmetra as support, but you cannot beat the power of her teleporter and the annoying little turrets. Roadhog can be a great counter to the Reinhardt/ Bastion combo if he is able to get behind them. D.Va is good at being an annoying poke tank as well as a counter to torb and bastion if the team is organized.

Last time competitive was up, the best way to go was 2 healers, 1 tank and a mix of defense for utility and DPS for the damage. This also heavily depends on if you are on attack or defense, or if it is a control map. Too many defense heroes isn't really a bad thing on defense. Also some heroes are just not well suited for certain maps. I do know that Roadhog is a MUST HAVE on the well at Illios since he can grip people into the well all day.

Last night I played a game with some guildies against a team that decided to pick 3 Reinhardt. Mei was a very good counter because her wall can block his charge, she can sneak behind and freeze him as well as make him turn around, and Mei's ultimate did really well since everyone is usually stacked behind the Reinhardt.

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Re: What team composition do you think is optimal?

Post#15 » 10 May 2016, 20:45

Cremate wrote:
SGTMinor wrote:I don't know how i feel about Mei she seems really strong flexible still has weakpoints. But in a nutshell i think she is just a bitch to have on the other team. it's like one of the most cheesiest champions i hate her. even if i'm sniping at range with Hanzo I hate her. i don't know where to put her into a comp though other than the annoying one


I second this... couldnt stand playing against Mei. But at the same time, I never felt she was strong enough that we needed one on our team. It's like her soul purpose is to be a pain in the ass. Thats a similar role as Tracer, but I feel Tracer has more impact on the game.


Well that is her purpose. If she gets behind the enemy line she can freeze and easily kill any low health heroes that get too close to her. She is not supposed to do a ton of damage, but she is a utility that can freeze enemies that can then be focused down by the team. If you can even just annoy the hell out of the other team, it will keep them off of the objective for longer. She is very powerful on either side if played right.

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